Please use this thread all week to comment on any Mets-specific topic you wish.

The Athletic just released the answers to their Mets survey, with nearly 3,000 responses. Here are a few of the results:

Which of the following Mets prospects are you most OK with trading?

Khalil Lee – 35.5%
Ronny Mauricio – 31.7%
Mark Vientos – 16.3%
J.T. Ginn – 7.1%
Matt Allan – 3.8%
Brett Baty – 3.5%
Francisco Alvarez – 2.0%

My vote went for Lee, too. Anyone who voted for Alvarez should have all of their responses in the survey eliminated.

How do you feel about the black uniforms?

Fine they’re back for Friday nights only – 58.0%
Ecstatic they’re back and hopeful they’ll be worn more often – 31.4%
Disgusted they’re back and hopeful they’ll be discarded – 10.5%

Unlike the previous one, where my pick aligned with the top response, this time it’s with the bottom pick.

What should the Mets do with Robinson Canó?

Commit now to Cano being a part of the 2022 roster – 3.0%
Give him a shot in spring training to be an everyday player – 15.2%
Give him a shot in spring training to be an occasional starter – 43.4%
Release him now – 29.9%
Try to trade him for another bad contract – 7.1%
Try to trade him, even if it means attaching a good prospect – 1.4%

It should come as no surprise that my vote was to release him now.

34 comments on “Wednesday catch-all thread (1/19/22)

  • JimmyP

    How do “we” process the information that one of the stated main attractions to the Mets for Martre was the prospect of playing with Robinson Cano?

    • Brian Joura

      I missed this news (or forgot about it) so I had to look it up. This is from Mark Sanchez’ piece in the Post:

      “Marte said the two have long talked about joining up, though they had not discussed the prospect this offseason. Once Marte signed with the Mets, the two connected.”
      https://nypost.com/2021/12/02/mets-starling-marte-always-wanted-to-play-with-robinson-cano/

      I dunno – if it was so crucial to his decision to sign with the Mets, I would have imagined that they would have discussed it before he signed. It’s clear that they’re friends and just like any friends, I’m sure they talked about playing together. But I’m quite certain the 4/$78 had way, way more to do with why he signed with the Mets than any friendship with Cano.

      I have 100 worries about the 2022 Mets. But the reaction of any player to releasing Cano does not crack the list.

      • T.J.

        I wonder (theoretically) how much of that guaranteed $78 million Mr. Marte would part with to keep Cano on the team.

        Lee is a nice prospect and did a great job bouncing back in AAA after that harsh stink in the bigs, but I understand why he would be viewed as the most expendable prospect. No prospect is a “sure thing”, but how did Alvarez get even one vote for most expendable? There must have been some Phillies fans that infiltrated this survey. Check those voting machines.

        • Name

          I guess when you’re a disgusting filthy cheater like Marte you gotta stick up for your fellow cheaters because that’s the code of criminals.

          • Chris F

            right on point Name.

          • José

            Please inform, what did that sweaty cheater Marte do?
            Should I google “Marte” and “sweat”… I mean “cheat”?

  • JimmyP

    I’m just asking what you make of the situation, and whether you (any “you”) give credence to player feelings, clubhouse perceptions.

    I believe Marte may have commented on Twitter, I don’t know if your research extended that far.

    And, yes, obviously he’s a Mets because of the contract. But there are players, particularly Latin players, who hold Cano in high regard.

    If he’s being released on moral grounds, it should have been done already. Since that’s not the case, I think it should be eliminated from the equation. If he’s being released because you don’t believe he can replicate his 2020 slash of .316/.352/.544, I’d think that taking a good look at him in ST would be prudent. He might be useful, no? If you are releasing him because you are still mad at Brodie, that’s another issue altogether. It might be that you (or whomever) feels that Cano is in the way of Dom Smith. Maybe that’s true. But why not take a look? What’s the point of releasing him today?

    • Brian Joura

      As Chris F. is fond of saying – the name on the front of the jersey is more important than the name on the back.

      Do I give credence to player feelings, clubhouse perceptions? Yes, but you have to earn that. If Jacob deGrom tells me something, I’m listening. If I’m running the team and I’m going to make a major acquisition, I’m running it by deGrom. Not only wouldn’t have I signed Scherzer, I wouldn’t have signed Lindor before getting deGrom’s input. In a few years, I hope to say the same thing about Lindor. At no point ever in my Mets life would I do that for Cano.

      Your point about Latin players holding Cano in high regard is noted.

      Over and over again, we’re told how Spring Training stats don’t matter. I just can’t see why that should be disregarded for a baseball senior citizen trying to come back from a year’s absence. And in the particular case of Cano, he had a great Spring Training in 2019 only to be a disappointment that year.

      Also, it seems to me that we have enough circumstantial evidence to safely throw out making any strong cases based on 2020 – whether that be for Michael Conforto or Dominic Smith or Cano.

      Why release Cano now? To eliminate a repeat of the circus that we saw when Yoenis Cespedes tried to come back after missing so much time. To eliminate the temptation to use him, because he’s being paid so much. And to give opportunities to others without having to look over their shoulder and wonder if one mistake puts them on the bench so that Cano can get PA.

      • Chris F

        from your keyboard to Cohen’s ears.

  • Wobbit

    Dom Smith has no claim to be held back by Cano or anyone else. He has gotten three seasons of significant opportunity. If he plays for the team this season, it certainly would be a make-it-or-break-it year.

    If he makes it, he gets to play 1B semi-regularly in the future with Pete as a DH. If he breaks it, he hits below expectations, sleep walks though another season, and gradually loses playing time… failing to earn a roster spot for the future.

    In my mind, he needs a significant rise in performance to “make it.” Every player has to ultimately find a way to specifically contribute to the team.

    • Jimmy P

      I don’t believe it’s a smart move to alienate Pete, who is very clear that he wants to stay on the field.

  • Metsense

    Vientos because he hasn’t a position that isn’t blocked. He is more of a one dimensional player but the one dimension is elite power. Lee is 23 yoa,with an excellent AAA year in 2021 and he is a five tool player.
    Blue ( for the Dodgers) and Orange (for the Giants) were the colors chosen from day one. The Mets are Blue and Orange and that is what they should wear.
    Cano has let the Mets down. Personally I don’t like him. $48 M that isn’t my money to spend so if Cohen wants to give him a chance, then so be it. Cano has to play himself off the roster or be disruptive . He should not on the roster if he turns out to be an albatross.

  • BoomBoom

    I voted for Mauricio because he’s obviously blocked at his primary position and would likely bring back the best value as a centerpiece of a trade for a starter or high end reliever. If Lindor gets hurt, Guillorme can fill in at short.

  • Woodrow

    Don’t trade Mauricio. He’s going to be better than Alvarez and Baty. He’s only 19,already showing power despite not having filled out yet and as a SS should be able to transition to another position.

    • BoomBoom

      I don’t know. He strikes out a lot. Alvarez doesn’t. Alvarez may end up being our Buster Posey – he has that kind of potential.

    • TexasGusCC

      What!?

  • TexasGusCC

    Like Metsense, I’d vote for Vientos also out of those names because he really is without a position; second would be Mauricio. Lee is a five tool player that had a good year at AAA, why the hate? Had he not been up for 12 at bats early on or even been another team’s prospect with those gaudy stats, everyone would be salivating for him.

  • JimmyP

    A writer at MMO, Nate Mendelson, wrote a detailed profile of Ketel Marte and suggested this package (which shocked me):

    JD Davis, Ronny Mauricio, JT Ginn and David Peterson.

    He concluded that wasn’t enough to get it done.

    It made me wonder, once again: Do you think the Mets need to trade a prospect this off-season in order to try to become competitive with the Braves?

    Also, I get Mauricio slipping 20 spots in MLB’s prospect rankings because of plate discipline (I’m still bullish), but poor Mark Vientos dropped from 88 to off the list completely. What’s a guy got to do? I think he’s a hitter. No idea if the glove/arm combo is average, poor, or very bad.

    • Metsense

      That proposed trade is shocking. The Mets would be foolish to entertain it.
      Vientos had a excellent minor league season in 2021. The scouting reports says he is a hitter and his defensive is below average. If he adapts well enough to play leftfield, first base and play defensively better than JD Davis then JD would be expendable. He probably is expendable now. JD is a proven hitter but he is a one dimensional player. With the universal DH and three years of control left, his trade value might rise.
      Mauricio should be the future Met second baseman.

      • JimmyP

        My dream comp for Mauricio is Alfonso Soriano. That guy had lightning in his wrists, swung a heavy bat.

  • JamesTOB

    I read an article today proposing a trade between the Mets and the Brewers. The Mets would get Josh Hader and the Brewers would get McNeil, Dom Smith and J.T. Ginn. Jim Bowden of The Athletic liked the proposal. The article notes that there might be hesitation about including Ginn in the deal. I don’t think the Mets should trade Ginn, so I would want to go with a 2 for 1 trade or include a different pitcher who is likely to be a reliever. I wonder what y’all think of such a trade.

    • JimmyP

      Very reluctant to trade Ginn. Mets are so short on pitching in system and he potentially slots into a decent backend starter (and cheap!). Would like to see him develop another year.

      As a rule, don’t love trading big for “name” relievers.

    • TexasGusCC

      If Jim Bowden likes it you know it’s a ripoff. He is in love with names and doesn’t quantify talent. McNeil alone is enough, and even then I’d rather have the .300 hitter than the reliever! Hader seems to be a guy the Brewers are dying to sell high on and no one is biting.

    • Jimmy P

      On SNY, Anthony Recker proposed adding Kolton Wong to the deal for the Hader and I suddenly became very interested: a trade that would address two key weaknesses for the coming year.

      I think he was talking something like McNeil, Mauricio, Davis, Szupucki.

      I might do that deal — haven’t taken a long look at Hader’s numbers and health.

      The team doesn’t have a 2B and the bullpen is barely average at this point.

  • TexasGusCC

    Well, it’s out! One of my favorite prospect sites…

    https://www.prospects1500.com/nl-east/mets/new-york-mets-top-50-prospects-2022/

    • TexasGusCC

      I must say, at first glance I’m a little disappointed in this year’s version. Usually there’s more meat to indulge on… Even the list gives me pause. Oh well, it’s another something to talk about.

    • Brian Joura

      Gus, earlier you asked why I was so eager to trade Khalil Lee and this pretty much sums up why. In a system with half a dozen real prospects, this site has Lee ranked 12th.

      The guy ranked directly ahead of him – Carlos Cortes, whom I’ve never been a fan of – had perhaps the most damning opening line you can put out there for a top-20 hitter. It said, “Cortes shows the capabilities of being a utility player…” In other words, he’s not there yet but if everything breaks right…

      In my mind, Lee is more of an athlete than a baseball player. We all want to see more athletic guys on the team but they’ve got to be able to play the game. Hope I’m wrong and Lee turns out to be a 30-30 guy for the Mets.

      • Jimmy P

        Lee seemed to completely lack pitch recognition.

        Somehow in AAA he walked a lot. But that might simply underscore the difference between AAA and MLB.

      • TexasGusCC

        I can’t say you’re wrong, especially with Prospects Live saying that Lee struggles recognizing spin, but, I’m hoping… very, very hard. Last thing I want to see is another Willy Mo Peña, even though one year of 26 home runs would be very tempting… I hope Lee can get a chance to show his tools.

        What would rather be if you’re Lee and had to pick one: Willy Mo or Kirkkkkk Nieuwenhuis?

        Edit: I added a couple of ks to Nieuwenhuis’ name. It may be completely silly on my part, but I’m not comfortable with 3 ks.

        • Brian Joura

          B-R has Wily Mo playing 8 years in MLB and making $6.9 million and Kirk playing 7 years and making $2.4 million. Both dollar totals are greater than what B-R has, as they don’t have salary for all years for either player. But it sure looks like Pena wins in both years in the majors and dollars.

    • JamesTOB

      I see they’ve ranked Ryley Gilliam as a Tier 5 player. Wasn’t he considered a significant prospect not all that long ago? Why the low ranking?

  • Wobbit

    Things have clearly shifted with regard to prospects. I mean, 2-3 years of Josh Hader at his best is worth just about any sacrifice of farm talent. Unless you have a Mario Soto or a Mike Trout down there, the game is still about winning at the ML level, and Hader would move your team a full notch forward… and immediately, without waiting. Great talents like Soto or Trout don’t spend much time down there, and you know who those guys are before they even arrive.

    What if the Mets had traded away Pete Alsonso four years ago for Hader? Even given Pete’s awesome emergence, are we sure Hader would not have given comparable production, especially if the Mets were more competitive?

    • Jimmy P

      I totally agree with this.

      Look at the trades for Piazza and Delgado.

      As for Hader, I don’t value a top reliever the way I would an everyday regular.

      But fans in general tend to wildly overrate prospects, IMO. MLB does, too, but part of that is due to the financial benefits. The Players Association would like to address that in the new CBA — but the owners are going to screw them to the wall, once again.

      It would create a shift, I think, if young players had to get paid sooner. Some of the “value” would go down.

  • Wobbit

    What’d Mariano Rivers mean to the Yankees for a decade?

    It meant that in many games they only had to worry about 24 outs. If the starters get them 18-21, the bullpen game came down to 3-6 outs. Two innings.

    That changes everything.

    Puts tremendous pressure on the opposing manager. As a manager one year, I had a fearsome guy in our bullpen. I enjoyed watching the fidgeting begin on the other bench as soon as he got up to warm up…

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