As everyone knows by now, the Mets traded four players to Cleveland for Francisco Lindor and Carlos Carrasco. The Mets pick up a major upgrade at shortstop and a vital frontline starter for the next three years. While I didn’t consider upgrading from Gimenez to Lindor a necessary move (especially considering the money) there’s wisdom in making the trade when it comes to Carrasco. With Noah Syndergaard and Marcus Stroman likely to leave after the season the Mets needed to acquire some backup for Jacob deGrom for 2021 and beyond.
My view as the minor league guy is always against trading prospects. I will forever bemoan the trading of Jarred Kelenic and Justin Dunn for Edwin Diaz and the steroid shell of Robinson Cano but, this is not that trade. Both Lindor and Carrasco are still at the height of their careers and proven players while Diaz was unproven and Cano was in unmitigated decline. So long as the Mets still sign an everyday center fielder so Brandon Nimmo can play in left field, this works for me.
Yet, with any trade, we have to sift through the information of who was sent away and the futures that might have been. Let’s wish the former Mets well in their baseball futures and hope their successes will come against teams outside of the Mets.
Amed Rosario, SS – The #1 Prospect
After following the Mets and their prospects for almost 20 years (which seems impossible) memory only recalls one Met prospect achieving the vaunted #1 spot on the MLB prospect rankings. Back in 2017 Rosario achieved that honor. Back then people had begun to sour on Dominic Smith and had (rightfully) given up on David Thompson, so Rosario seemed to be the greatest hope for a bright future.
The key to his ranking was in that his solid offensive numbers seemed to come along with excellent defense. Sadly, the defense seemed the part of his game that never came up from the minors. With just glimpses of greatness at the MLB level, Rosario is looked at as a disappointment but, perhaps he’ll get the last laugh at the fans who think his rankings were completely overblown. If he ever puts both parts of his game together, he has the talent to make good on that 2017 ranking and prove to be the “prize” of this deal for Cleveland.
Andres Gimenez, SS – Only 22 Years Old
At 22 most MLB prospects are still below AAA but Gimenez is not most MLB prospects. Gimenez has always seemed to play heads and tails above the level of the competition of other prospects his age. Many, including myself, doubted if his bat would hold up in the majors. Thanks to 2020, some of those doubts were erased and most Met fans were gearing up to see Gimenez manning the position for years to come. Few people expected the Mets to deal away a prospect that had successfully come up to the majors and who had so many years of team control remaining.
We, at Mets360 have been following Gimenez’ development since 2016 when the 17 year old burst into the DSL and performed well above expectations. Dismissing all stats from the DSL, it was 2017 when most Met fans sat up and took notice. At the age of 18, he managed a respectable .695 OPS in Columbia (a team in a pitcher’s league). This would lead to a mid-year promotion in 2018 where he would obliterate Advanced A before moving to Binghamton but in 2019 he came back down to earth in his second season of AA.
Eighteen games in the Arizona Fall League (later in 2019) were our only clue as to the echelon of player the Mets still had on their hands. Which player was the real one? The .695 OPS player we’d seen in Binghamton or the .999 OPS superstar we witnessed in Arizona? The answer was somewhere in between the two. As we saw, Gimenez managed a steady .732 OPS in his major league debut, while providing solid defense and tons of positive energy. He will be missed.
Josh Wolf, RHSP – The Other Draft Pick
One of the best things Brodie Van Wagenen accomplished with the Mets seems to be his drafting. The 2019 amateur draft still looks, on paper, like a coup of epic proportions. In the draft the Mets took Brett Baty in the first round and picked up the 13th overall ranked prospect, Matthew Allan in the third round when most teams assumed that the prospect would decline a contract offer and proceed to college. In all of this, people may have forgotten that the Mets picked up Wolf in the second round, despite him being ranked to be picked towards the tail end of the first.
Wolf has barely had a chance to prove himself since that draft but, did look like he had the “stuff” that teams look for when they search for front-end starters. He has a reasonable shot of achieving a solid career but is still too far away from the majors to call it likely.
Isaiah Greene, CF – Crow Armstrong’s Insurance Policy
There were some feelings of ambivalence when the Mets selected Greene with their second round pick this past year. On the one hand, he was among the most talented players left. On the other, he profiled too closely on the same path as the player the Mets had taken with their first pick. Greene has speed with some hitting ability and seems likely to be able to hold onto his role in center. He was a solid prospect but always smacked of the Mets not quite having faith in Pete Crow Armstrong panning out. Without getting to review any performance numbers in the minors no one can say much more; yet, we should recognize that he still has the potential to reach the majors and make an impact.
Consider this a fond farewell to Rosario, Gimenez, Wolf and Greene. My outlook on this trade is pretty rosy but it was still important to talk about the players the Mets have sent away. We all know we may see them again in years to come and may well rue the day that Cleveland came calling with a trade opportunity.
I considered Gimenez the Mets’ Jeter… 15 years of steady shortstop, solid offense, speed and leadership. He was remarkably mature and commanded some attention in the batter’s box. He will become that for another team now. I can accept and even applaud this trade in that we get the promise of Gimenez right now in Lindor. Carrasco makes the deal even better, if he can perform at his highest (never a sure thing) and stay healthy. Regarding Rosario, he’s a good kid and a good player who clearly lacked a clear role on the team. It’s ok to trade good players for good players. I think Dom might be in the same position, and maybe JDD as well. If someone values them, trade for pieces needed on the current team.
Hey Wobbit,
Thanks for reading! I will really miss Gimenez as well but the Mets saw a way of improving their lineup and rotation without giving up any of their current Top 10 prospects (in some rankings none of their Top 20).
With the NL seeming likely to approve the DH, I’m confused by your willingness to trade Dominic Smith. Having Smith and Alonso in the lineup seems like something that every team would want to have. Additionally, unless the Mets sign a new second or third base player, the Mets need J.D. Davis to man third and Jeff McNeill to man second.
Hey David, I’ve been slower to adopt Dom as the legit bat everyone seems to think he is… but he did have a great, albeit short, season in 2020. The previous year he started out hot and dropped precipitously, then got hurt which cut off the experiment. I believe he might have dropped to under .250 had he not been sidelined. Hardly spectacular. Celebrated his last at bat of ’19, though… I like the kid. If he is what everyone says he is, no doubt he is valuable. My greatest concern is what his playing first base does to Pete, who struggled at the plate while primarily DHing. Pete is an old school mentality, and he wants to play the field. Pete will hit 50 HRs a year, especially if well-positioned in the lineup. Obviously, if we trade Dom, I would want an equal return or better, which is what trades are all about.
As far as JD is concerned, I love the guy. I thought he was the MVP (position player) of 2019. He can also produce .280 plus with 25 HRs a year if he gets the ABs. But I’m a defense first (and speed) guy. Defense always wins more games than offense. JD is not a third baseman. I thought he was actually better in LF, with a great arm. But again, if we can find a quality 3B with comparable upside, I let JD bring his value back to us on the market. I’m a huge fan of Guillorme. If given the chance, I think the guy can challenge hitting .300., with great D. I expect at least a platoon situation with Luis and JD at third until something changes. Wob
JD and Guilome at 3B,it might work. If they get a CFer and there’s no DH who plays LF? Do you trade Nimmo or Smith? Which one?
The value of Dom Smith depends on the DH. I would like to ask the question. Who has a reasonably priced 3B or extra 3B to trade who could use a 1B? What about Pittsburgh. Smith for Colin Moran.
Mariel Franco?
Nimmo is likely the better fielder in LF, but not that much better to sacrifice a lot at the plate. I think we know what Nimmo is offensively, may even get better at it. Smith is the wild card. Is he the extra base machine of 2020? Does he came back to earth this season? The DH solves that problem. Best solution to me is to get equal value for Smith on the market, get a more versatile solution and a RH outfielder with some upside (speed, power, super defense) to give more flexibility in the outfield. M. Gonzalez? I’d be sorry to lose Dom, but not sorry to lose the problem of where to play him. Rosario was the same problem, no longer a problem… Let’s hope McNeil can play a solid 2B to avoid the problem there too.
I’m not sure what you are sacrificing at the plate with Nimmo. He’s got a career 130 OPS+ which would likely be better if he didn’t get hurt in 2019.
Exactly. I even expect Nimmo to improve over time, maybe cut down on strikeouts, hitting to all fields (Chili should help this year). I attended three Mets games at Coors Field in September 2019, and Nimmo was off the charts (he’s from Wyoming). Dom maybe a tad more power, but otherwise not a difference enough to warrant a drop in defense. Unless they make a move soon, we will watch this dilemma play out, and we will have another season of Dom to determine his actual value.
Ursela?
After 3 years service time Rosario is statistical below average major league shortstop. Without the DH he would not have a starting position. Last year he was beaten out of his position by Gimenez. With Lindor the Mets got an exceptionally good shortstop for one year and if they don’t sign him then they will get higher draft pick than Wolf or Greene was. If they can’t signed Lindor then there will be a good crop of free agent shortstops next year to choose from. They also have their number one prospect Mauricio in the minors with an ETA of 2022 per MLB. The Mets are positioned no matter what the outcome is in the Lindor negotiations. The icing on the cake was obtaining a good mid rotation starting pitcher for the next 2- 3 years.
Metsense,
Thanks for your steady and consistent dose of Met sense.
Lots of emotion in David’s piece, but it’s a trade the Mets couldn’t say no to. All these players could turn out all-stars and still it’s a trade that must be made. In fact, I believe the biggest beneficiary will be Rosario. In Cleveland, Lindor got the attention, but he wasn’t “The Man”. José Ramirez is “The Man”, and also from the Dominican Republic as Rosario. A quiet, hard working and unassuming player, Ramirez doesn’t get the press but his numbers are better than Lindor’s. If Ramirez can get Rosario to focus and work hard, the Indians will have an all-star player. It doesn’t appear that would have happened for him in New York. Wish all the guys well.
Don’t understand the C+ rating from both MLBTR and CBS Sports for the Indians.
Are you thinking the C+ is too low?
Way too low. Anything less than a B, is unrealistic. They shopped Lindor for two off seasons, and certainly advertised openly this season.
I think the thought that they did not get at least one top 5 prospect was the driving force for that. From my perspective, they did quite well with arguably (or maybe not arguably) two starters for positions of need for them at short and second, along with a couple guys that could be very good if brought along effectively. I liked Greene, but I have a certain bias for defensive guys that can run after watching the Mets outfield since Beltran and Cameron left.
To be honest, with the position that they took when they went public saying that they were going to trade Lindor, and the fact the the market is flooded with still unemployed decent shortstops, they did about as well as they had any right to. I think the grade also was driven down with the inclusion of Carrasco, although they are loaded with young pitching talent, and the dollars they shed will help them.
I guess I would say “B” was a reasonable grade for them.
I usually dont like players after they have been traded. But, I really hope that Rosario and Gimenez both play really well for Cleveland.
Yes, funny how that works, and yes, I’ll be watching and rooting for them in Cleveland as well. I suspect they will start together at the keystone and both can have very good seasons.
(Also, Cleveland has been my AL team to root for for a long time).
Born in NJ and having lived in Cleveland this trade intregues me. I wondered what the tribe had up its sleeve. They didn’t draft Lindor. Your going to love him. He goes from 0 to an Elite hitter before your eyes. You will know exactly what im saying soon. As for the prospects you describe. It would be the first time at least 1 of those guys becomes an impact player. Carrasco ? Got his fastball back at the end of last year after fighting LUKEMIA the year before !